What a vulnerable share! I’m not sure how I stumbled upon you and this interview share—popped up in Notes I think. As an Aussie who lives in Finland and is currently in the UK, travelling on the smell of an oily rag, it’s an interesting glimpse at a life I’ve only ever seen on TV (and can we believe all we see there?!). I’ve never been to NYC and haven’t stepped foot on North American soil since my family left a two-year stint in Canada in 1979. It’s kind of like reading a fantasy 😂
Maybe you haven’t spent much time in cycling crazy parts of Europe like Denmark and Holland reading about your complaints about cyclists 😂
Anyway, thanks for sharing your (very rich) life with us (very not rich) folks 💖
As someone who became wealthy after selling our family business, I often have a hard time reconciling why me? I try to give back, stay normal and not take things for granted. I still don’t feel comfortable buying luxury items but will splurge on vacations and did buy a second home. I hate when people say things like white privilege or assume I haven’t struggled. Up until about 10 years ago, we were very middle class.. not sure what I’m saying but it can be hard wrapping your head around what it means to have wealth. Thanks for sharing your story. You are a talented writer.
You’ve enough deep pockets to pay for my words . I thank you. Wealth? I know the tune. A symphony I heard . Daily . Born and grew up in Beverly Hills , escaped !?to NYC and Greenwich in my early twenties. My friends and some family in your tribe. I wrote about a dinner with my friend Hawley Hilton’s Grandparent Conrad . Just he, my sister mother
and I in Casa Encantada. Think it’s on market now for zillions. Mr Hilton rise to power. Self made. His life story . Not rags to riches.. but pretty close. He was probably 80 and seemed to have a crush on my 21 year old beautiful red haired sister. Yup still the old man with an eye and living alllll alone in his “glory” with his poodle sparky and trusted manservant Hugo. All the riches and I felt sympathy. What’s the expression ? No pockets in shrouds . Reading your interview. Fun! A great life, family and ..Fifth Ave across from Central Park. My old stomping grounds. Good morning
Thanks for this interesting interview! I agree that people in general not only the wealthy should be more involved in art and cultural matters, I grew up in Europe/France and am still amazed how much cultural background and knowledge everybody has over there…
Things that make wealthy people or not humble besides upbringing, are chores and travel 😉
There is nothing wrong with being wealthy; there is only something wrong with feeling superior to other people because of your wealth (or lack of it).
Most people think they want to be rich, but what they truly want is to feel rich.
I live in rural Texas, where most people are poor, but feel rich. (Rural poverty is VASTLY different from urban poverty - which is hell).
Romanticizing poverty is obscene, but so is romanticizing wealth. It's vitally important to have enough money to afford decent housing and healthcare, but other than that, money doesn't add much to quality of life, and can actually have a numbing effect on the soul.
Like David, I am 62, and my husband and I are retired. We live on about $3000 a month (less than the cost of one night in David's preferred hotel). I don't begrudge him this; if he needs to spend $4000 a night to enjoy his vacation, well, okay.
Like David, I wake up at about 5:30. I enjoy a glorious sunrise, listen to roosters crowing, and may get to catch sight of a few deer.
My husband and I enjoy our morning coffee together (I make him a cappuccino in our fancy cappuccino maker) and we talk nonsense.
Most days (except in summer, when you can only walk in the early morning) are good for walking outside. I have an adorable but bratty little Maltese (his adoption was my 60th birthday splurge) and God is clearly punishing me for adopting from a breeder instead of from a shelter, because he is the worst dog in the world. I adore the little beast.
I take him on a daily walk, during which I carry him most of the way.
He has a knee problem which will need to be operated on, and will cost $3000 (luckily, we have a credit card).
After he gets his walk, I take myself on a walk where I feed carrots to my neighbors' goats and donkeys. I also take a walk to visit the cows, whom I adore, and whom I feed long weeds because they don't like carrots for some reason. I love hand feeding all these little angels.
The air out here smells sweet and sometimes a little smoky from all the fire pits and barbeque.
Twice a month I enjoy volunteering at the food bank (many volunteers also receive food from the food bank, and most of us are neighbors - there is very little economic segregation).
We laugh and joke and pray together, so I consider the food bank my church.
I love to bake, so I bring baked goods to share at the food bank, which is a lot of fun.
We have twice monthly farmer's markets and art sales and mini festivals at the town square.
My in laws helped us build an adorable shed in our backyard (which we need because our house is only 1100 square feet) and they give us free eggs from their chickens. (Many of my neighbors have chickens and they wander all over the street like they own the place).
I love to garden and we get explosions of wild flowers in the spring, and I even managed to grow a watermelon last summer.
We get so many butterflies that it feels like living in a Disney movie. And we get sharp red cardinals, and multicolored buntings, and tuft heads and finches and ground doves and so many beautiful noisy birds.
I have a salt lick in my front yard for the deer, and I put out feed for them every night.
And every night, they bless me with their presence. It never stops being a gift to see these graceful beings step timidly into my yard.
The Texas Hill Country is glorious, and I feel so privileged to live here.
Being rich is useless if you don't feel rich; and having more than enough money is no guarantee of happiness or personal "wealth".
From one rich person to another, Thank You for your post, David.
May you and your family enjoy continued health and happiness.
I would be willing to pay for a month's vacation at your home. You sound as though the sweet spot has been created and it sounds bliasful. Your writing gives me the felt sense of your space and I can feel my heart rate lessen. Thanks for sharing. If you want to open an Airbnb, please let me know so I can be the first customer!
Beautifully written and well said. Your writing brings back to fond memories of a difficult chapter.
Many years ago, I lived in Bandera, Texas.
There, we wore our poverty as a badge of honor. We could survive despite the wealth we imagined others enjoying. We could feast on a few dollars a day.
The saving grace, and a common thread throughout my life, has been appreciation.
It doesn’t matter if you’re filthy rich or dirt poor. How do you perceive the world around you?
Monetary wealth would feel nice, I imagine. The truth is, how would life change?
At 56, I get up at 5:30. I make my man his breakfast (I’ve been through a few, mostly abusive. Some were poor. Some were better off. This man, he’s kind, which is new for me.) and get in my morning exercise.
I make a fancy coffee in my espresso machine and sit at my altar/desk for prayer, contemplation/writing/witchcraft/ shenanigans.
Sometimes I just stare out the window at the hummingbirds.
My days are filled with tasks that bring me fulfillment and connection.
I still work. I am a healer (massage therapist) a teacher (yoga instructor, life coach) and a writer. While I’m not monetarily rich, I am wealthy beyond my wildest dreams.
Eight children, who are successfully adulting. Friends who love me. This beautiful world, that keeps spinning. There is so much beauty to appreciate.
Thank you for your clarity. Reading your words, I immediately thought of the garish “billionaire” Donald Trump who, though wealthy on paper, is psychologically and morally impoverished. Money won’t buy you integrity.
Love seeing you smile straight at the camera. When I was a child I heard constantly how we weren't rich but we were happy (lol) and good (double lol) unlike the wealthy who were shallow and unhappy.
Among the many things that would point out the hypocrisy, there was an evening when I was very young, maybe not even a teen yet, my parents stated when I grew up I should marry an officer, and I said if I loved an enlisted man I would marry him . To which they flipped out. They felt so certain I should marry someone of higher status and money, that they became infuriated when I insisted I wouldn't marry for that reason. They sent me to my room.
Granted our family was built on abuse and lies, but much of it was not acknowledged. This was so on the surface it stuck out with me. Though I pushed back on my parents that night, their attitude toward money and their hypocrisy did impact me and inform my relationship with money.
Would I like more money? Yes. I can say that now without feeling like I'm a bad person or shallow. I've come to see that it's not money, itself, but like everything else, our relationship to it, that gives it its meaning, and honestly, you've helped me in that direction, David.
Every relationship has pitfalls and slippery slopes where we can lose our balance if we don't have the self-awareness needed to know what's important and who we are. Whether that's relationship with money or people or aspects of our own selves.
These days, my grandchildren make me feel richly alive. When I am with them I am truly with them. Other things that may worry, even frighten me disappear as I get sucked into this vortex of present moments with them. They are living, walking, racing, giggling, belly laughing with joy or crying in frustration in each passing moment. Whatever is real and immediate to them. No pretension in any direction.
And when they invite me to join them, I always say yes. No matter how I feel. No matter how creaky my bones. I am suddenly, irresistibly energized. And happier in a way that was totally inconceivable to me at one point of my life. Most of it, actually.
Every day, I meet something, or someone, who stretches my view of the world and the people in it. You are one of them, David. You're a regular person. You're also an extraordinary one. And a good friend to many. That's something money can't give you or the lack of it take away.
Still just as good, revelatory and funny the second time around. I get even more fun reading the comments and responses as it's not often the other 99.9 percent get to glimpse into a life like yours let alone comment directly to the 0.1 percent. It still doesn't seem real to me, as Lisa says below, my version of your life is "as seen on TV". Regardless, we're all lucky to have you here sharing your writing and your world with us. Fascinating and thought provoking always.
Very nice. You hear people say that any income >70K year (in general, maybe not Manhattan) is enough to bring one to a point where your life isn't unhappy due to lack of money, extra money beyond that doesn't generally bring more happiness. I believe that. I think anyone who is at least professional class economically, and is doing work they broadly enjoy, has it made - and its not that hard to achieve if one is disciplined and focused. Seems to me that financially secure creative types who can work their art are in the best place. I also find that having more stuff is often a burden. More things to worry about and maintain.
David, when I discovered your Substack, I felt annoyed that you’d write (brag) about being wealthy.
Then, I began reading it.
You are a kind man who also happens to have money. Your writing bears that truth, and this interview, which is well done, shows that you are just a man.
I don’t say that with any disrespect, but admiration. You don’t hold yourself apart and above. Thank you for agreeing to the interview. Thank you for sharing yourself authentically.
There are a lot of things I’ve really come to admire about you, David. None of them are your money, but one of them is how your money informs your sensitivity and sense of responsibility in and for the world around you. I know you to be a remarkably devoted, kind and introspective man with an intentional and good heart and a genuine concern for the people you know and those you otherwise wouldn’t intersect with. You would probably be this way regardless of your wealth, but perhaps it has enhanced those qualities a bit.
This interview does a very good job of showing that, and helps to deconstruct some of the derogatory stereotypes attached to wealth. And I lol thinking about you being a bad driver.
Good morning, David. I see your strength on display in your allowing yourself to be vulnerable, a la Brene Brown and others. Your honesty and authenticity come through clearly about who you are and being comfortable with your station in life at 62. Besides writing as your new vocation, are there any other adventures you might consider in the coming decade? Curious and inquiring mind interested in what you might consider. Stepping outside your comfort zone into unfamiliar, uncharted territory or does that sound like too much of a risk? Would you and Debbie ever consider living in another, unfamiliar country and culture for a month or more? Thailand for example? Others? Happy November to you and your family!
I love that you write, that it keeps you humble, connected to all sorts of people, and especially because I like to read it! Thank you for all you do for the Kelly Writers House.
As you may know, I was an interviewer and then the manager of interviewers for many years and it is quite common to feel some kind of let-down after being interviewed and, indeed, that you said more than intended (very easy if you have a good interviewer). I gave a talk about this at a conference for researchers years ago, inventing the term 'Post Interview Depression' (PID). I believe other researchers then did research into the phenomenon. I suspect your feeling that you might have revealed too much may come from this, but if it helps, I don't think you revealed too much. Nothing that could embarrass your wife and family. You come across as yes, very rich, but also very reflective and very generous. And interesting.
What a vulnerable share! I’m not sure how I stumbled upon you and this interview share—popped up in Notes I think. As an Aussie who lives in Finland and is currently in the UK, travelling on the smell of an oily rag, it’s an interesting glimpse at a life I’ve only ever seen on TV (and can we believe all we see there?!). I’ve never been to NYC and haven’t stepped foot on North American soil since my family left a two-year stint in Canada in 1979. It’s kind of like reading a fantasy 😂
Maybe you haven’t spent much time in cycling crazy parts of Europe like Denmark and Holland reading about your complaints about cyclists 😂
Anyway, thanks for sharing your (very rich) life with us (very not rich) folks 💖
As someone who became wealthy after selling our family business, I often have a hard time reconciling why me? I try to give back, stay normal and not take things for granted. I still don’t feel comfortable buying luxury items but will splurge on vacations and did buy a second home. I hate when people say things like white privilege or assume I haven’t struggled. Up until about 10 years ago, we were very middle class.. not sure what I’m saying but it can be hard wrapping your head around what it means to have wealth. Thanks for sharing your story. You are a talented writer.
thx
You’ve enough deep pockets to pay for my words . I thank you. Wealth? I know the tune. A symphony I heard . Daily . Born and grew up in Beverly Hills , escaped !?to NYC and Greenwich in my early twenties. My friends and some family in your tribe. I wrote about a dinner with my friend Hawley Hilton’s Grandparent Conrad . Just he, my sister mother
and I in Casa Encantada. Think it’s on market now for zillions. Mr Hilton rise to power. Self made. His life story . Not rags to riches.. but pretty close. He was probably 80 and seemed to have a crush on my 21 year old beautiful red haired sister. Yup still the old man with an eye and living alllll alone in his “glory” with his poodle sparky and trusted manservant Hugo. All the riches and I felt sympathy. What’s the expression ? No pockets in shrouds . Reading your interview. Fun! A great life, family and ..Fifth Ave across from Central Park. My old stomping grounds. Good morning
Lord Grantham is one of my all-time TV characters, really captured the sense of noblesse oblige I've seen among the nobler wealthy folks I've met.
Thanks for this interesting interview! I agree that people in general not only the wealthy should be more involved in art and cultural matters, I grew up in Europe/France and am still amazed how much cultural background and knowledge everybody has over there…
Things that make wealthy people or not humble besides upbringing, are chores and travel 😉
There is nothing wrong with being wealthy; there is only something wrong with feeling superior to other people because of your wealth (or lack of it).
Most people think they want to be rich, but what they truly want is to feel rich.
I live in rural Texas, where most people are poor, but feel rich. (Rural poverty is VASTLY different from urban poverty - which is hell).
Romanticizing poverty is obscene, but so is romanticizing wealth. It's vitally important to have enough money to afford decent housing and healthcare, but other than that, money doesn't add much to quality of life, and can actually have a numbing effect on the soul.
Like David, I am 62, and my husband and I are retired. We live on about $3000 a month (less than the cost of one night in David's preferred hotel). I don't begrudge him this; if he needs to spend $4000 a night to enjoy his vacation, well, okay.
Like David, I wake up at about 5:30. I enjoy a glorious sunrise, listen to roosters crowing, and may get to catch sight of a few deer.
My husband and I enjoy our morning coffee together (I make him a cappuccino in our fancy cappuccino maker) and we talk nonsense.
Most days (except in summer, when you can only walk in the early morning) are good for walking outside. I have an adorable but bratty little Maltese (his adoption was my 60th birthday splurge) and God is clearly punishing me for adopting from a breeder instead of from a shelter, because he is the worst dog in the world. I adore the little beast.
I take him on a daily walk, during which I carry him most of the way.
He has a knee problem which will need to be operated on, and will cost $3000 (luckily, we have a credit card).
After he gets his walk, I take myself on a walk where I feed carrots to my neighbors' goats and donkeys. I also take a walk to visit the cows, whom I adore, and whom I feed long weeds because they don't like carrots for some reason. I love hand feeding all these little angels.
The air out here smells sweet and sometimes a little smoky from all the fire pits and barbeque.
Twice a month I enjoy volunteering at the food bank (many volunteers also receive food from the food bank, and most of us are neighbors - there is very little economic segregation).
We laugh and joke and pray together, so I consider the food bank my church.
I love to bake, so I bring baked goods to share at the food bank, which is a lot of fun.
We have twice monthly farmer's markets and art sales and mini festivals at the town square.
My in laws helped us build an adorable shed in our backyard (which we need because our house is only 1100 square feet) and they give us free eggs from their chickens. (Many of my neighbors have chickens and they wander all over the street like they own the place).
I love to garden and we get explosions of wild flowers in the spring, and I even managed to grow a watermelon last summer.
We get so many butterflies that it feels like living in a Disney movie. And we get sharp red cardinals, and multicolored buntings, and tuft heads and finches and ground doves and so many beautiful noisy birds.
I have a salt lick in my front yard for the deer, and I put out feed for them every night.
And every night, they bless me with their presence. It never stops being a gift to see these graceful beings step timidly into my yard.
The Texas Hill Country is glorious, and I feel so privileged to live here.
Being rich is useless if you don't feel rich; and having more than enough money is no guarantee of happiness or personal "wealth".
From one rich person to another, Thank You for your post, David.
May you and your family enjoy continued health and happiness.
I would be willing to pay for a month's vacation at your home. You sound as though the sweet spot has been created and it sounds bliasful. Your writing gives me the felt sense of your space and I can feel my heart rate lessen. Thanks for sharing. If you want to open an Airbnb, please let me know so I can be the first customer!
Beautifully written and well said. Your writing brings back to fond memories of a difficult chapter.
Many years ago, I lived in Bandera, Texas.
There, we wore our poverty as a badge of honor. We could survive despite the wealth we imagined others enjoying. We could feast on a few dollars a day.
The saving grace, and a common thread throughout my life, has been appreciation.
It doesn’t matter if you’re filthy rich or dirt poor. How do you perceive the world around you?
Monetary wealth would feel nice, I imagine. The truth is, how would life change?
At 56, I get up at 5:30. I make my man his breakfast (I’ve been through a few, mostly abusive. Some were poor. Some were better off. This man, he’s kind, which is new for me.) and get in my morning exercise.
I make a fancy coffee in my espresso machine and sit at my altar/desk for prayer, contemplation/writing/witchcraft/ shenanigans.
Sometimes I just stare out the window at the hummingbirds.
My days are filled with tasks that bring me fulfillment and connection.
I still work. I am a healer (massage therapist) a teacher (yoga instructor, life coach) and a writer. While I’m not monetarily rich, I am wealthy beyond my wildest dreams.
Eight children, who are successfully adulting. Friends who love me. This beautiful world, that keeps spinning. There is so much beauty to appreciate.
Thank you for sharing Texas.
“Being rich is useless if you don't feel rich…”
Thank you for your clarity. Reading your words, I immediately thought of the garish “billionaire” Donald Trump who, though wealthy on paper, is psychologically and morally impoverished. Money won’t buy you integrity.
"Who is rich?" asked, Ben Zoma. "Those who are happy with what they have".
Not an absolute truth, nor a universal one - but a truth nonetheless.
Love seeing you smile straight at the camera. When I was a child I heard constantly how we weren't rich but we were happy (lol) and good (double lol) unlike the wealthy who were shallow and unhappy.
Among the many things that would point out the hypocrisy, there was an evening when I was very young, maybe not even a teen yet, my parents stated when I grew up I should marry an officer, and I said if I loved an enlisted man I would marry him . To which they flipped out. They felt so certain I should marry someone of higher status and money, that they became infuriated when I insisted I wouldn't marry for that reason. They sent me to my room.
Granted our family was built on abuse and lies, but much of it was not acknowledged. This was so on the surface it stuck out with me. Though I pushed back on my parents that night, their attitude toward money and their hypocrisy did impact me and inform my relationship with money.
Would I like more money? Yes. I can say that now without feeling like I'm a bad person or shallow. I've come to see that it's not money, itself, but like everything else, our relationship to it, that gives it its meaning, and honestly, you've helped me in that direction, David.
Every relationship has pitfalls and slippery slopes where we can lose our balance if we don't have the self-awareness needed to know what's important and who we are. Whether that's relationship with money or people or aspects of our own selves.
These days, my grandchildren make me feel richly alive. When I am with them I am truly with them. Other things that may worry, even frighten me disappear as I get sucked into this vortex of present moments with them. They are living, walking, racing, giggling, belly laughing with joy or crying in frustration in each passing moment. Whatever is real and immediate to them. No pretension in any direction.
And when they invite me to join them, I always say yes. No matter how I feel. No matter how creaky my bones. I am suddenly, irresistibly energized. And happier in a way that was totally inconceivable to me at one point of my life. Most of it, actually.
Every day, I meet something, or someone, who stretches my view of the world and the people in it. You are one of them, David. You're a regular person. You're also an extraordinary one. And a good friend to many. That's something money can't give you or the lack of it take away.
Still just as good, revelatory and funny the second time around. I get even more fun reading the comments and responses as it's not often the other 99.9 percent get to glimpse into a life like yours let alone comment directly to the 0.1 percent. It still doesn't seem real to me, as Lisa says below, my version of your life is "as seen on TV". Regardless, we're all lucky to have you here sharing your writing and your world with us. Fascinating and thought provoking always.
Very nice. You hear people say that any income >70K year (in general, maybe not Manhattan) is enough to bring one to a point where your life isn't unhappy due to lack of money, extra money beyond that doesn't generally bring more happiness. I believe that. I think anyone who is at least professional class economically, and is doing work they broadly enjoy, has it made - and its not that hard to achieve if one is disciplined and focused. Seems to me that financially secure creative types who can work their art are in the best place. I also find that having more stuff is often a burden. More things to worry about and maintain.
David, when I discovered your Substack, I felt annoyed that you’d write (brag) about being wealthy.
Then, I began reading it.
You are a kind man who also happens to have money. Your writing bears that truth, and this interview, which is well done, shows that you are just a man.
I don’t say that with any disrespect, but admiration. You don’t hold yourself apart and above. Thank you for agreeing to the interview. Thank you for sharing yourself authentically.
There are a lot of things I’ve really come to admire about you, David. None of them are your money, but one of them is how your money informs your sensitivity and sense of responsibility in and for the world around you. I know you to be a remarkably devoted, kind and introspective man with an intentional and good heart and a genuine concern for the people you know and those you otherwise wouldn’t intersect with. You would probably be this way regardless of your wealth, but perhaps it has enhanced those qualities a bit.
This interview does a very good job of showing that, and helps to deconstruct some of the derogatory stereotypes attached to wealth. And I lol thinking about you being a bad driver.
Also: your art!!!!!
Good morning, David. I see your strength on display in your allowing yourself to be vulnerable, a la Brene Brown and others. Your honesty and authenticity come through clearly about who you are and being comfortable with your station in life at 62. Besides writing as your new vocation, are there any other adventures you might consider in the coming decade? Curious and inquiring mind interested in what you might consider. Stepping outside your comfort zone into unfamiliar, uncharted territory or does that sound like too much of a risk? Would you and Debbie ever consider living in another, unfamiliar country and culture for a month or more? Thailand for example? Others? Happy November to you and your family!
I love that you write, that it keeps you humble, connected to all sorts of people, and especially because I like to read it! Thank you for all you do for the Kelly Writers House.
As you may know, I was an interviewer and then the manager of interviewers for many years and it is quite common to feel some kind of let-down after being interviewed and, indeed, that you said more than intended (very easy if you have a good interviewer). I gave a talk about this at a conference for researchers years ago, inventing the term 'Post Interview Depression' (PID). I believe other researchers then did research into the phenomenon. I suspect your feeling that you might have revealed too much may come from this, but if it helps, I don't think you revealed too much. Nothing that could embarrass your wife and family. You come across as yes, very rich, but also very reflective and very generous. And interesting.
Btw did you watch The Perfect Couple on Netflix, set in Nantucket at the old money 'Winbury' estate? I finally watched it all. What did you think?